Hi

I have a question about rasgueo technique as it is taught in a couple of the different dvd methods

Firstly I agree with Sam that Juan Serrano's sami is sooo smooth I would love to master that one. It alone was worth the purchase price of his dvd to watch him build it up from slow to full speed, very impressive.

I recently got the Graf-Martinez vol 1. Now on rasgueo, he says the thumb should be bent, even hooked over the 6th string, however I originally started with books and cd's and thumb shape was never mentioned, so i tend to play with my thumb straight just like it should be for reststoke. What is his thinking behind the bent thumb?

I also got the Aaron Gilmartim - easy steps to flamenco guitar, as it was going real cheap. Now this was one that wasn't mentioned earlier this thread. In his rasgueo he says that the bottom E (Edit: 1E) string should always always ring out as this gives a very flamenco tone and color. Where as G-M advocates getting a strong 5th A string and the bottom E (Edit: 1E) doesn't matter and it doesn't sound like he hits that 1E much apart from his upstrokes.

Listening to them play both sound good...so is this just down to personal taste?

I edited this as I think I may have given the wrong idea about which E string I meant..sorry bout that

GM teaches the most accepted and modern way. Hooking the thumb gives support for a more powerful downstroke with the fingers and also keeps the hand positioned for the final stroke up with the index > amii. Some old school players use to hook their thumb for the sami also. Hooking the thumb can be an advantage with fast index strumming such as the Bulerias. I am not familiar with Gilmartin. The problem is if one plays the 6th string in the rasqueado then probably they will not hit the B2 or E1. The length of the little finger prohibits this unless one moves their hand position down and up while doing the rasqueado. Also one might use their thumb touching the guitar top for support and this forces the hand into the strings and takes away the leverage one might get by having their hand out further using the E6 for support. Also many chords used in flamenco don't use the E6 anyway.

It is a personal decision and one to experiment with.

I love to see how these posts evolve!! But getting back to the original question- I don't think I could reccommend one method. I reccommend using as many methods as you can stomach. The problem with that though is that each book is so different with regards to rasgeuao. Serrano with his starting with the i (isami), Koster with his incessant and overuse of the 5 stroke (samii), GM with his 3 finger flicking. Most methods jump from simple to complex way too fast. I give props to GM for not making this mistake. If you don't read music well then the Juan Martin method (not the "Play" series) can be downright intimidating. The GM books have you doing just rasgeuo and thumb work initially although you need to have a good ligado technique to play some of it. Unfortanely, I don't think he considered this enough and he should have given some ligado exercises early in the book. I think overall, from what I've seen, they are the best books. Regarding the issue of a teacher, I think most of us will not have access to a genuine flamenco instructor. I think one should at the very least find a good classical instructor to learn the mechanics of good technique (free and rest stroke) and supplement that with "Master Classes" if one is fortunate enough to take them. Regarding learning good timing and having good compas, buy cd's (or mp3 downloads) with palmas and cajon. Play the compasses as you have learned them straight up then "jam" to the palmas. Lastly, find a dancer willing to put up with you.

Gitano Escocia wrote:
I also got the Aaron Gilmartim - easy steps to flamenco guitar, as it was going real cheap. Now this was one that wasn't mentioned earlier this thread. In his rasgueo he says that the bottom E (Edit: 1E) string should always always ring out as this gives a very flamenco tone and color. Where as G-M advocates getting a strong 5th A string and the bottom E (Edit: 1E) doesn't matter and it doesn't sound like he hits that 1E much apart from his upstrokes.

Listening to them play both sound good...so is this just down to personal taste?

I edited this as I think I may have given the wrong idea about which E string I meant..sorry bout that

Yes, this does make a difference. The E1 is what helps give more brillance to a rasqueado and in most cases desirable.

Omni, I agree with you for the most part. My biggest complaint about GM is he comes off very mechanical and his German accent and lack of expression is tiring. IMO he should have lightened up a lot. He also teaches more the modern way. His sound IMO lacks warmth. Another method to discuss is:

Manuel Granados

I have all four of his methods that I recently bought new for a high price, but will sell soon because....

His playing is more classical flamenco than old time gypsy flamenco
It is all written in Spanish
He advances rapidly. He shows a simple falseta, the next one adds a difficult ligato, the next one difficult arpeggios, etc.
It has a lot of palos that don't interest me.

I think his method would be great for a serious student that wants to become a great player and has the natural skills to advance quickly. He is an excellent teacher and player with a strong flamenco and classical background. I prefer to learn from a teacher that is only a flamenco player, but that is a personal preference.

I think the best way in todays world if a good flamenco teacher isn't available, is online or video lessons where you can play for the teacher. This requires having a simple recording system and emailing clips back to the teacher. Another alternative is to post video or audio clips on this forum and get feedback in the form of audio or video demos of how to correct a problem.

As has been mentioned before the key to correct learning is first listening and learning to clap along and instill the compas in your brain. Pick out a palo you are working on and listen to different players with and without cante and palmas. Since I started listening more and playing less, my playing is getting better for compas.

One of my favorite utube teachers is Jose Martinez Caro. I think his approach is the best, even though I have to guess at what he is saying in Spanish.